OVHA Chat

Well, the time has come to construct a brew sculpture a.k.a. brew cart a.k.a. Brewzilla (haven't decided on a good name yet). I've been thinking about it for awhile and finally decided to draw out some plans and see what I could do. I'm going to document the progress in this post and then make a formal "Hot-To" on my website when it's complete.

Some background: I usually do 10 gallon batches and my keggles will only fit on one burner I have. So there is a lot of lifting of hot heavy things which sucks. I have one March pump that will handle boiling temps but to do a fly sparge I still need some gravity. So I knew I'd need a two-teir system. I've also been playing around with the Heat Exchange Mash Recirculation System (HEMRS) idea to regulate the mash temp. So I have an idea of what I want, so time for some plans.

I got a lot of inspiration from this post http://hbd.org/discus/messages/366/33621.html . It's a 20 gallon system bolted together out of old bed frames. I don't have a welder, and I know a couple of people in the club have offered to help weld, but I wanted to build something in my spare time in the garage with the tools I have. This bolted bed frame design looks very doable. All you need is a cheap angle grinder and a drill. If it holds a 20 gal system, my 10 gal system should be golden. See also this website for lots of pics of systems, some good, some bad... http://www.brewzilla.nl/?brewhalla

So a couple of days ago I sketched this up in Google SketchUp to get a rough idea of the dimensions and how much stock I would need. Pictured here with and without kegs. I decided to go with some thing short and squat, just deep enough to hold the kegs, 16" and right now I have it at 12" off the ground for the first tier plus a few inches for the casters. I'm still deciding on that measurement. It will be nice to see everything in the pots but will mean some stooping to adjust the pump settings. It's a start. With the bolted design I can always adjust it later. I should have plenty of stock left over.

I was debating on just getting some new angle iron stock. I needed 11 6' sections of 1.5"x1.5" 3/16" thickness. Well, the price at the local mega-low-mart was outragious. Online prices weren't much better. So today I went scrounging for old bed frames. I put some feelers out to my co-workers but no bites. I hit a few yard sales but came up empty. Why-o-why didn't I think of this during heavy trash pickup! I ended up at Grandpa's Trading Post on 1st Ave. They had a freaking stockpile of them. By my measurements I needed 5 frames. I haggled him down to $15 each. Still much more than I really wanted to pay, but I felt my options were limited if I wanted to get started on this soon. I know once I get started they will be laying around everywhere for the taking...

So here is the Day 1 progress:
The first order of business was to separate the long side sections from the short header and footer sections. This connection is by a rivet. I thought I could just cut heads with a 4" angle grinder but I was cutting a lot of the metal. I decided to bring the operation indoors and use the little drill press to drill them out. This was much better as the garage has a air conditioner! If you go this route, be sure to slow down the drill, use lots of oil, and let the bit cool so you don't over heat it and ruin it.
Next up will be measuring and cutting!

Didn't do to much last night. Started marking cuts from this cut list I've drawn up:

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and realized something wasn't right. I was using an old cut list that had the HLT much higher. So I went back and redid the cut list and double checked everything.

Well, I learned one thing tonight. I can not cut straight with a hand held 4" angle grinder. I'll be taking these into work to get cut.

OK, took all the steel into the metal shop at school and had the instructor set me up. It's amazing what you can do with the right tools.

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This chop saw went to town on those bed frames! It also makes nice straight and clean cuts.

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I had all 30 parts cut and debured in less than 2 hours! Well, 28 pieces, the two diagonal braces won't get cut till the beast in together and I can take a measurement.

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Brought everything home and set up a jig in the drill press to make consistent holes for the bolts. Here's the first test piece. This bit is wore out, wouldn't even get through one hole.

I hope to get more drilling done over the weekend. I have a step bit somewhere I use for making holes in kegs for weldless fittings. I may give that a try.

Before the cookout on Saturday I did a little work on the sculpture. I did a dry fit with lots of clamps of most of the parts just to see how it was all going to lay out.

The boil kettle end is really a stable box so I just couldn't resist setting a keggle on it to see how it's going to look. Sweet!

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I have over half the holes drilled! Only around 25 or so to go. The hole drilling has been the most tedious thing so far. I'm using 3/8" x 3/4" bolts. I got a cobalt steel 3/8" drill bit. They are expensive at $12 each but it's the only drill bit that has made a dent in this steel and even then it's slow going with lots of breaks to add more cutting fluid. The first bit chipped the cutting edge after around a dozen holes. It had a "pilot point" on it and I think this was a poor design. I took it back for an exchange and the new one without the pilot point is doing just fine.

Here is the set up I have in the drill press now. I forgot I had these nifty vice grip hold down clamps, they really speed things up. When I have marks on the outside of the angle iron I use this scrap wood for support, it's the perfect hight.
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And I finally got to put some bolts in! I add a few bolts, put on the next piece, mark through the drilled holes for the next hole so everything lines up perfectly. This takes awhile... As you see here, it is a close fit with these huge bolts. The nuts touch, but the bolts don't.
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And the final project for tonight was to cut the notches in the top vertical pieces to accommodate the tall vertical pieces for the HLT. I used a combination of hack saw/Dremil/Vice Grips/file to get the notches cut. This really weakened the top vertical pieces. I may be adding in some more support for the mash tun.
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I've done a final count, and if I add in three cross braces, it will be at exactly 100 drilled holes. There's something to be said for welding. Anyway, I got most of them done tonight and started putting it back together to get the final measurements for the cross braces. It doesn't feel quite as stable as I hopped so I'm upgrading to three braces.

This is the first time I've had enough structure together to put the mash tun in position. It seems the right hight for the HLT to feed the sparge arm.
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The spot for the HLT (Hot Liquor Tank) didn't look quite square so I put a bunch of clamps on it to square it up before marking the final four holes.
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I'm going to add in a few of these 6" pieces so the kegs don't rock and keeps them in place. I'll try using high temp epoxy first as there is not much room for more bolts.
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Right now I'm trying to find casters that are narrow enough for the thin rail. Since the burners are so close to the ground, I think I'm going to get metal ones just in case. McMaster Carr seems to have what I'm after. I'm also in need of some extruded metal or something similar to line the base of the structure to set the propane tank on. I've still not found exactly what I want. I'll probably just use wood in the time being. The next stage after construction (after testing to see if it's going to collapse) will be to run some hard piping for the propane. I've never done that so it's about time for some googling.

Chris, thanks for taking the time to document your project. Maybe you could market a kit of pre-cut and drilled parts.

Thanks for the comments! Mass market bed frame brew carts! I doubt it, I really hope this one stays together a long time because I don't want to do another. Please feel free to make suggestions or ask questions, I'm just typing out my progress and learning curve. I'm sure there are better ways to do just about everything I've done.

Drilled all I could drill tonight, which wasn't much, just the burner supports and the top two HLT rails. I made measurements for three cross braces and will cut them tomorrow after work in the metal shop plus a few 6" pieces for extra keg stabilization.

Everything looked sturdy enough, so after I put on the HLT burner I set the HLT on, then the mash/lauter tun, then the boil kettle. Super sweet. I looks just like in my head, mostly. All it needs is some casters and it's ready to roll!

Front and back views:
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I stuck the pump on with a wire tie just to see the positioning. I'll need some U bolts or similar to make it semi-permeant. I think I'll add in a switch for it. I'm still unsure of the propane piping. Anyone ever do any gas piping?
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Here is the burner support for the HLT.
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Great project. Could you not weld the joints? It might have been a bit less work than so many holes to drill and nuts to tighten.

The short answer is yes. Although I have heard that the high carbon content of the bed frame steel makes the welded joints brittle and prone to crack. But I have no welding experience so I can't say that is the absolute truth. A couple of the guys in the club have offered their welding rigs but I wanted to build something in my shop on my time. If you have a welder I would say use it, as drilling all these holes blows monkey balls.

Ok, that makes sense. Good luck on the trial run.

Wow, that is pretty sweet. Thanks for documenting it.

I'm such an imbecile that I couldn't even get that software to work - much less build that rig. I surely looked like a load of work.

I do have a question- how do you clean the spent grain out of the mash tun ? Just lift and dump?

SketchUp was a pain in the arse but I eventually made it do what I wanted. Yep, left and dump. The keg sits on top of my large trash can so you don't have to hold it up. I put the spent grains in the garden during the fall and winter. They go out to the curb and ferment during the summer. I bet the trash man loves me.

On to the progress report. Got the diagonal braces cut and installed last night. Had to do a little modification with a hacksaw (use bi-metal blades) to get them to fit just right. It took some persuasion with a hammer to get them in place. I only used two because I ran out of metal.

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I had to notch this piece with the hacksaw for the boil kettle burner support and attached the other burner.
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And the casters arrived! I love McMaster-Carr, one day delivery everytime! I'll be installing these tonight. They are 2" metal wheel, part# 78155T52 & 78155T53. The mounting holes just fit on the bed rail. The mounting plate on the swivel ones hangs over a little.
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Still working on my gas hardpipe problem. I have some things figured out, but I can't seem to be able to unscrew the flexible line out of the regulator in order to add a 2 ports to it.

Drilled and attached the casters tonight. I tried to drill with the hand drill but it was taking forever. I ended up disassembling the bottom rails to use the drill press. Reassembly was a pain.

It's a low-rider...
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Drilled holes and attached the water filter and pump. I did use the hand drill for these holes but it took a long time. I used a quick clamp to help apply pressure. Don't try this project without a drill press! The pump is 90 degrees from the original position I had it in. I like it here much better facing out as it protects the pump. I had to rotate the pump head 180 for this to work. I added a bit of aluminum sheet for shielding. I'll work up something better when I get the chance. I also need to add some copper pipe in a 'J' for the water filter 'out' line so I can hang in on the HLT while it's filling up. I'll probably add a quick connect to the 'In' side to get rid of that hose to tidy it up.
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An over all shot.
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I think I'm on the right track for the propane hard piping. I found out that I need to get some propane orifices for the burners. The ones that are on my existing hoses can't be removed. That tread is 1/4 fnpt and goes to a 3/8 flare male fitting. So I need a 3/8 flare to 1/2 npt. Then I can use regular 1/2 npt black pipe. I've got it arranged to have the valves on the front side of the cart for easy adjustment. I've got it all figured out in my head anyway. The tricky part is getting the right lengths of pipe and nipples so it will run where I want it to when it is all screwed together. It needs to run close to the cart so it will be supported. I guess that's why plumbers get the big bucks. It will be worth it to run both burners off one tank which is stored neatly on the cart.

I've been working on the name. I'm thinking I'll go steampunk style and call it "Ale Generating Apparatus".